With or without power commander?

[varanman]

Used the search engine and couldn't find answers. But here's my question:
If you have an after market exhaust (TBR) and ride the 6R for about a month without a power commander, will it effect the engine's life in the long run? I finally saved up enough to buy a power commander and should be getting it towards the end of this week. I noticed that when I start the engine it surges a little? I guess that's the word that I want to use. Any information would be greatly appreciated. Thank you

 

[leprecaun jon]

Used the search engine and couldn't find answers. But here's my question:
If you have an after market exhaust (TBR) and ride the 6R for about a month without a power commander, will it effect the engine's life in the long run? I finally saved up enough to buy a power commander and should be getting it towards the end of this week. I noticed that when I start the engine it surges a little? I guess that's the word that I want to use. Any information would be greatly appreciated. Thank you

as long as you dont keep it weened off of that power commander then you should be fine, what happens is your allowing the engine to breath and produce more power then it is meant to produce without being dialed in or regulated (by a pwr commander) so your bike will run a little lean... depending on your conditions, as long as its not pro-longly exposed to the conditions without the power commander then you will be ok in the long run... surges are a common occurrence with people with out a power commander. i dont know to much more on the details but as long as you get a commander you should be good.

 

[varanman]

Thank you very much. I've added over 1,000-1,500 miles without the power commander. Thanks again that was very useful information.

 

[leprecaun jon]

Thank you very much. I've added over 1,000-1,500 miles without the power commander. Thanks again that was very useful information.

your :welcome: its my pleasure to help

 

[varanman]

Would you say about 1,000-1,500 miles is bad?

 

[JSP]

You should get one as soon as you can. You can run lean and cause some damage...

 

[varanman]

Absolutely. I already have a PC coming in the beginning of next week. I'm only concerned about it being too late.

 

[Hellgate]

Every Power Commander map I've seen for a Yamaha takes out more fuel than it adds. Yamaha has the maps fat and cleans it up the CAT. You're fine.

If you do get a PC, get a custom tune, your bike with thank you.

 

[leprecaun jon]

1k no...but if you keep it on there for an extended period your asking for trouble...

 

[Hellgate]

1k no...but if you keep it on there for an extended period your asking for trouble...

How? Please explain

 

[Marthy]

1k no...but if you keep it on there for an extended period your asking for trouble...

I don't claim that the map that I made are the best thing since slice bread... but there pretty solid! 6R RevB (Sport, Advgear or Touring) are probably some of the best. Correct me if I'm wrong.

I customize a map for my needs. In a advgear set up I used Touring RevB on the first 4 gears, and RevD in 5th,6th. Just to give you an idea... I barely add 1% to 3% of fuel in the cruising range. On the Auto Tune it was a safe 14.0:1 FR. So without a PCV it will work. Might not get the most performance out of it, but it will not blow up driving around town. If you hit the track... I might suggest you to add a fuel controller for performance gain.

My maps are available on my website. Might not be as good as a custom map made by a pro with the right tools, but it's a really good start. PCV allowed you to adjust fuel trims only anyway... Getting your ECU re-flash and by a pro would be the ultimate things to do. So you can get everything adjusted... timing, fuel...

 

[leprecaun jon]

How? Please explain

your running the bike with a optimized breathing system essentially... its a lot like breathing say 90% Oxygen... opposed to what you breath on a normal day, after a long period of time your lungs get so use to breathing that much oxygen with little work...( its like running lean) that when you go back to breathing normally... its hard to do ( like a smoker running a mile apposed to a none smoker) same thing accounts for a bike if you run it lean, or rich its whole life or over a long period of time, no matter the conditions you will run into problems, if your running rich you will have a lot of carbon and gunk build up later in the cylinder bay, fuel injectors become clog, and the engine struggles to burn fuel like it normally should, if your running to lean, you will have an optimum power exertion but will cause increased wear and tear on an engine.. kind of like a turbo on a car... you cause the engine to over work.

 

[Marthy]

your running the bike with a optimized breathing system essentially... its a lot like breathing say 90% Oxygen... opposed to what you breath on a normal day, after a long period of time your lungs get so use to breathing that much oxygen with little work...( its like running lean) that when you go back to breathing normally... its hard to do ( like a smoker running a mile apposed to a none smoker) same thing accounts for a bike if you run it lean, or rich its whole life or over a long period of time, no matter the conditions you will run into problems, if your running rich you will have a lot of carbon and gunk build up later in the cylinder bay, fuel injectors become clog, and the engine struggles to burn fuel like it normally should, if your running to lean, you will have an optimum power exertion but will cause increased wear and tear on an engine.. kind of like a turbo on a car... you cause the engine to over work.

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[rjohnson5481]

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+1!
Lean optimum power? Not quite, lean meaning not enough fuel too much Oxygen. someone please correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[Marthy]

Not here to give a crash course... I'll let the Marthy map and Acc. Pump setting dot the talking! All I'm saying is the best "power" map barely make 38 MPG...

Some people call that "Walking the walk"

End of the story... LOL

 

[leprecaun jon]

your right, about to much air... im no pro.. im just saying what i have been told by my uncle, my dad and the friends i have at the local shops around here... none the less the point is, in the long run with out a power commander it will eventually have a negative effect, it wont be something that happens over night no... and you would have to be putting close to 30k on the bike to really notice, i do know however that the surges get worse as the bike wears without the commander. marthy has dealt with the maps... so he knows how the commander works better than i do.. and im sure some one else on here knows a hell of a lot more about this topic than i do... i am in by no means a experienced mechanic.... i just know how to take care of my rides.

i know i didnt hit a home run... but i am in the park lol...

 

[CeeCeeFree]

We have a dyno tuning shop located at Infineon Raceway in Sonoma California. Just picked up a 2011 FZ6R and a 2011 FZ8. We'll be custom mapping both of them with power commanders, will let you all know what sort of numbers we get.

 

[varanman]

This is the best visual explanation of what the commander does. This man is brilliant.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZaCKyoMQVM]The Basics of a Power Commander - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Marthy]

We have a dyno tuning shop located at Infineon Raceway in Sonoma California. Just picked up a 2011 FZ6R and a 2011 FZ8. We'll be custom mapping both of them with power commanders, will let you all know what sort of numbers we get.

That would be nice to compare them on the dyno and road.

 

[Marthy]

This is the best visual explanation of what the commander does. This man is brilliant.

The Basics of a Power Commander - YouTube

That's very basic but accurate. The 6R work the same way. Anywhere from 13.8 to 13.0 is what I used for the Sports map. Any leaner than 14.0 the bike was running like crap.

Now there is a difference between having a sharp and crisps throttle response. A leaner engine will have a bit more zip. But a richer engine will give you more torque under load. In the case of the 6R, since the engine is a detune R6 (Same piston diameter) having smaller throttle body give you a higher peak air speed and acceleration when you crack the throttle open. If you run the engine on the lean side, the engine get really sharp on mid throttle acceleration... not good when you drag pegs, even on a low HP bike. Running on the fat side a bit (not too much, just enough) You get a smooth throttle response and a good torque out of it under load.

If you look at my map (Sport vs. Touring) the top end is the same. RevB over 20%, and RevD over 80%. So flat out there all the same! The touring map are set to run around 14.0:1-14.2 FR if I can remember well. So it's about +1% to +3% ( I think I put a bit more for RevB +3% to +5%)

All that said... every engine are a bit different (ECU also) So you either need a good dyno tuner, or a good butt dyno! :canada: