Good read

[dart1963]

"I remembered a phrase in racing that a wife costs you 0.2 seconds per lap and each child adds 0.5 seconds. It occurred to me that “winning” in the canyons was a game of risk, not of skill. The fastest man in the canyons – the man who took the most risk – was not the fastest or even the bravest. No, he was the man that had the least to lose. Having nothing to lose gives you an easy chance to put everything on the table. But your version of everything is not the next person’s version. Showing you are fastest in the canyons means showing you have the least to lose."


Thoughts On Risk And Death: Shades Of Primer Grey | My Life at Speed

 

[buzzbomb]

"I remembered a phrase in racing that a wife costs you 0.2 seconds per lap and each child adds 0.5 seconds. It occurred to me that “winning” in the canyons was a game of risk, not of skill. The fastest man in the canyons – the man who took the most risk – was not the fastest or even the bravest. No, he was the man that had the least to lose. Having nothing to lose gives you an easy chance to put everything on the table. But your version of everything is not the next person’s version. Showing you are fastest in the canyons means showing you have the least to lose."


Thoughts On Risk And Death: Shades Of Primer Grey | My Life at Speed

I didn't read what was in the link, nor did I watch the video. Why? Your description was perfect. It was exactly true to my personal experience.

It's relatively easy to take risks, on a motorcycle or life in general when it's only you.

Everything changes when somebody else is depending on you to survive. That's was true when I was Army, and it's as just as true now that I've a child and a disabled mother to take care of.

By nature, I ride a bit "spirited". But I never get on the bike without the gear. I wish I had that wisdom years and years ago. No, no one depended upon me... But I was loved, and my loss would have hurt those who love me.

That's why I wear the gear. For myself surely, but more for those who love me. I love them back, and if I seriously think about what they would be feeling at my closed-coffin funeral? Because the Authorities had to scrape me off the road?

No. I ride ATGATT.

 

[Chucker]

I think this is why a lot of trackday riders stop riding on the street. I have considered it myself. Not because I think the street is too dangerous, but because I cannot bring myself to push it on the street to the same degree I'll push it at the track, or to the extent I did when I was 20. Riding on the street just isn't as fun now that I've had multiple days at the track. I used to ride an hour to get to the few twisties closest to my home, but I now find it's not worth the ride as the chances are that I will arrive and there will either be a lot of traffic or there will be cops or hazards on the road. What I did when I was 20 now seems idiotic, yet I'm now a much better rider because of a race school and many days at the track, AND the track is a hell of a lot more fun than I ever experienced on the roads when I was 20.

 

[RoadTrip]

I have only ridden street, but I have heard same as Chucker that once you move closer to the limit on the track then the street is no longer as fun. That is partly why I have yet to go to the track.

However, since I haven't experienced the track, I will give my thoughts on pure street riding. I started 3.5 years ago and have about 36K sport riding. I was afraid at one point I would plateau and get bored with street riding, however I continue to learn and inch up on 'limits'. Street riding is about managing all the risks, finding the right spots, and decision making in regards to passing, road conditions, blind spots, etc.

It is a time away from work where you are totally consumed with the activity cause you brain is highly focused on the task at hand. You experience a similar 'flow' as other sports such as mountain biking, it flushes out your brain and you feel refreshed after a good session. You have to maintain control of yourself, listen very closely to traction and lean angle, remain within your known personally developed skillset, and constantly evaluate potential hazards - the beauty part is a relaxed, Zen like execution of skill and risk management.

Finally, I agree with the OP, a lot does depend on how much you have to lose, the rewards might be bigger with pushing closer to the limit, but if you can find satisfaction in riding at a more cautious pace and enjoy the nuances, I believe street riding can satisfy long term.

 

[Fizzer6R]

before the track, I rode only on the street for years w/some very fast guys. I was always mid-pack, and whenever I even tried to keep up I knew I was pushing too hard. the track guys said the same, once you do a track day you'll never be the same, and it's true, but not the same way for everyone.

for me, since the track opened my eyes, I haven't lost fun street riding. it does make you realize how dangerous all the distractions are.

all I can say is regardless of your opinion on either, you really do owe it to yourself to sample the track at least once, you really will be a much better overall rider for it. if you think you're aware of your surroundings now on the street, you have no idea. on the track you immediately remove all the public objects to worry about, and are able to concentrate on turning, braking points, body position etc. when I hit the road again it felt like my eyes/brain took off blinders and was amazed how much more quickly I saw all the dangers, feeling like my reaction time was increased ten times

 

[latony007]

i would love to try the track someday. There is one not to far away, im trying to get my brother to take his M3 out there.

Anyway i agree 100% about the how much you have to lose. Whenever i start to go a little to fast or get carried away i think of my 9 year old girl and that slows me down. As much as i like to go fast on occasion its more about getting out, away from everyone and being at peace for me anyway.

Honestly there have been several occasions where i thought to myself if i had this bike at 20 i would have wrecked it for sure and most likely myself along with it.

 

[Bert-Aus]

Before riding trackdays I thought I was quick through the hills.
Once I did my first track day that thought evaporated.

Having done 5 trackdays & come out of a accident that was cm's from taking my life; I have come to terms with my addiction to speed.

On the street & hills enjoy it for what it is, but remember that can be all taken away in an instant should you ask too much of yourself, your bike, the road or traffic around you.

The track (when/if I get back there) is where testing of yourself & your bike should remain.

Sent from my LT18i using Tapatalk 2

 

[buzzbomb]

The bravest, most admirable acts have always been when one risks everything because he has everything to lose. It's the difference between the old west gunslingers who fought just to say they were the fastest draw vs. the man having to draw fast to save himself or his family from harm.

I'm pretty sure that I'm not getting your point. We're talking about riding a motorcycle. Risk everything? Nothing to lose?

I'm not in a movie, and I'm not throwing lead at the bad guy with the black hat.

The gunslingers of the Old West were the minority. Most people, the vast majority of people, were just trying to survive.

I don't see what that has to do with ATTGAT on a motorcycle.

 

[alaskanflyboy]

I'm pretty sure that I'm not getting your point. We're talking about riding a motorcycle. Risk everything? Nothing to lose?

I'm not in a movie, and I'm not throwing lead at the bad guy with the black hat.

The gunslingers of the Old West were the minority. Most people, the vast majority of people, were just trying to survive.

I don't see what that has to do with ATTGAT on a motorcycle.

Somehow I managed to erase part of it. It's also one of my most poorly written. I can't remember what the rest was now. I think I may just scrub the whole post since it reads poorly as is.

 

[Bert-Aus]

Somehow I managed to erase part of it. It's also one of my most poorly written. I can't remember what the rest was now. I think I may just scrub the whole post since it reads poorly as is.

It did read VERY out of character from you,
Not to worry, we all have our evil moments

Sent from my LT18i using Tapatalk 2

 

[buzzbomb]

I have only ridden street, but I have heard same as Chucker that once you move closer to the limit on the track then the street is no longer as fun. That is partly why I have yet to go to the track.

However, since I haven't experienced the track, I will give my thoughts on pure street riding. I started 3.5 years ago and have about 36K sport riding. I was afraid at one point I would plateau and get bored with street riding, however I continue to learn and inch up on 'limits'. Street riding is about managing all the risks, finding the right spots, and decision making in regards to passing, road conditions, blind spots, etc.

It is a time away from work where you are totally consumed with the activity cause you brain is highly focused on the task at hand. You experience a similar 'flow' as other sports such as mountain biking, it flushes out your brain and you feel refreshed after a good session. You have to maintain control of yourself, listen very closely to traction and lean angle, remain within your known personally developed skillset, and constantly evaluate potential hazards - the beauty part is a relaxed, Zen like execution of skill and risk management.

Finally, I agree with the OP, a lot does depend on how much you have to lose, the rewards might be bigger with pushing closer to the limit, but if you can find satisfaction in riding at a more cautious pace and enjoy the nuances, I believe street riding can satisfy long term.

That is very well-said. If a rider can not find satisfaction on the road without being stupid, that rider needs to run on a track.

For the rest of us Riders? Those that simply love the fact that we're on a motorcycle and enjoy every aspect of riding?

The opportunities to improve one's skill are limitless, without being chased down by blue lights.

 

[buzzbomb]

Somehow I managed to erase part of it. It's also one of my most poorly written. I can't remember what the rest was now. I think I may just scrub the whole post since it reads poorly as is.

You still rock. Cheers and well wishes.