Bikes in Europe

[madmike]

I just spent a week in Paris on vacay with the missus. While I will spare you the full travel log (sights seen, the food, the douchebag French who work for Air France who decided to strike and stranded us for an extra day in an airport hotel...) but since this is a bike forum, I'd share a little about the bike environment in a major city like Paris.

The experience, from a riders perspective, was WOW. I knew that bikes and scooters were a preferred method of transport, but seeing it in action is a whole other animal. Bikes and scooters everywhere, and not the lame little Vespas, everyone is on those maxi-scooters now. We may scoff at them here, but they have some serious go and totally fit in around a city like Paris.

Bikes there seem to be all about function, and not nearly about fashion is they are here. Face it, everyone here gets litre bikes because they don't want to look like a pussy, and most can't ride them anyways. Then we all gussy our bikes up to make them look great (I'm among the most guilty, not making any accusations here.)

There, everyone does seem to slap on an Akrapovic exhaust, but beyond that, it's about function over form in city living. Everybody had luggagae hanging off their rides, and as it was crazy cold, had fixed hand gaitors and fixed lap covers for their bottom halves. Bikes were dinged up, scratched, hadn't seen a bath in ages. They were transport, getting from here to there.

And the array of bikes and bikes styles was staggering. Ducati Monsters and Hypermotards, BMWs everywhere. Hondas, a few Kawis, and tons of brands I've never even heard of. And lots and lots of Yammys. I saw exactly one FZ6R (or something similar enough to it), but lots and lots of FZ6s.

Very few, if any true sports bikes. I think I maybe saw one R6 or similar bike. Everything was more upright oriented...I mean EVERYTHING. Their mentality clearly was, if I gotta get around on this thing every day, I want to be comfy.

I also saw 3 Harley's. 2 Sportsters and one Road King!! The RK looked enormous compared to everything else, it was kind of awesome to see it there. It was also perfect clean every day (it was parked outside our hotel, and moved every morning.) What else would you expect?

The bikes ranged in size from lots of 125cc bikes (which still looked way cool BTW, especially the Yamaha R125s I saw) to big big BMW all terrain monsters and everything in between. And like I said, just tons of them. Bikes everywhere.

Driving skill and driving conditions? Sorry folks, but we don't hold a candle to these folks here in the USA. Say what you will about their laws requiring you to start off at small displacement engines and work up to get your license, versus our insistence on freedom, but their system works. I still fall on the side of individual freedom, but you can't deny their system yields better riders. They are all zipping along on cobblestone paved roads, in heavy traffic, with lunatic car drivers. They are safely splitting traffic, flying around roundabouts, and navigating very cramped streets with minimal distances between them and other riders or card drivers. I never once saw anything close to approaching an accident with a rider. One time in my whole trip I saw a rider honk his horn ONE TIME because a car started to change lanes into him, and it was resolved instantly and safely.

Did I mention the extreme cold front in Europe right now? It was below freezing the entire trip. Next to last day we were there, it snowed. Not a ton of snow, but enough to make the roads snowy and ice everywhere. Traffic was down considerably that morning across the board, but did it stop all the riders? Hell no, there they were, zipping around on all manner of bikes and scooters. All of them riding the same way, with their feet out and hovering just above the road ready to catch themselves. Clearly it was something they'd been taught, and safe or not, they rode around with complete confidence. I didn't see one shaky rider out there. Pretty cool.

All in all, it was awesome to see. I've been to Europe several times, but this was my first trip after taking up riding so I was like a kid in a candy store watching everything this time. Thought I'd share.

 

[TokenSSDD]

Sounds awesome to watch.

 

[dekaliber]

The Europeans generally are very civilized about how they conduct their business in traffic. Yielding to the right to passing cars, signaling before turning, paying attention to the road and having good situational awareness, etc. It's one thing I really wish we'd emulate. I'm all for tiered licenses if it helps us do that. No reason some 19 year old should be owning an M3 anyway. Just because you can't afford it, doesn't mean you should.

 

[madmike]

The Europeans generally are very civilized about how they conduct their business in traffic. Yielding to the right to passing cars, signaling before turning, paying attention to the road and having good situational awareness, etc. It's one thing I really wish we'd emulate.

I'd agree with you, except our shuttle bus T-boned a car that pulled out in front of us on our way to the airport yesterday. If you've ever been standing on a packed airport shuttle when it T-bones a car...it's awesome.

 

[Marthy]

Did you notice any left lane camper? I think here in the usa is the only place you can find those... They're all over Florida for sure, I can tell you.

 

[madmike]

Did you notice any left lane camper? I think here in the usa is the only place you can find those... They're all over Florida for sure, I can tell you.

No, but then again, we were in the city. I'm sure the highways are a different animal, but in general Europe isn't as bad as America for that.

 

[2wheelie]

This is my favorite subject... Let me tell you this right from the bet - US drivers are the worst in the world. And that's a fact. Not because it is their fault, it's just a driving ed here is sux comparing to European. Here everyone drives as they think (or can), and that's where's the road rage coming from.

As to European highways - noone will just cruise in the left lane unless passing. Moreover, if they see you closing in from behind - they'll move over right away to let you pass. There is not much of a solid line (like double yellow) on a secondary roads (only where is no visibility for passing) so you won't gona be stock behind a slow driver. All this and more makes riding much more enjoyable. Noone is afraid to drive fast, yet doing that skillfully as everything else.

In Paris there are no dividing lines around the Triumph Arch, and yet everyone knows their lane. I think here they'd be lost on that pretty wide circle...
I find driving/riding in Europe is way easier than here.

I rented a bike (F650GS) in Spain for few days, and when I came back in USA, for weeks I was driving the way you described in this post until noticed that I'm the only one who's riding like that...

 

[madmike]

This is my favorite subject... Let me tell you this right from the bet - US drivers are the worst in the world. And that's a fact. Not because it is their fault, it's just a driving ed here is sux comparing to European. Here everyone drives as they think (or can), and that's where's the road rage coming from.

As to European highways - noone will just cruise in the left lane unless passing. Moreover, if they see you closing in from behind - they'll move over right away to let you pass. There is not much of a solid line (like double yellow) on a secondary roads (only where is no visibility for passing) so you won't gona be stock behind a slow driver. All this and more makes riding much more enjoyable. Noone is afraid to drive fast, yet doing that skillfully as everything else.

In Paris there are no dividing lines around the Triumph Arch, and yet everyone knows their lane. I think here they'd be lost on that pretty wide circle...
I find driving/riding in Europe is way easier than here.

I rented a bike (F650GS) in Spain for few days, and when I came back in USA, for weeks I was driving the way you described in this post until noticed that I'm the only one who's riding like that...

I noticed all the same things on previous trips to Europe, but in cars. I've driven cars in Europe, and found it a great experience. The most challenging was in Britain, with the opposite side of the road and having to shift with the left hand, but it was a blast. But I have some formal advanced driver training, so much of what I saw on these roads, was right up my alley.

compare that with here, when I once got T-boned at an intersection when a lady in her 50s ran through a flashing red light. She literally had no idea what a flashing red light meant, so she went right through. How do you drive with a license for over 30 years and not know a basic traffic light situation???

Licensing here is a joke. The training and driving tests to get a license should be more stringent, I agree there.

i mean, two of the ladies in my MSF course couldn't start their bikes without stalling EVERY TIME. IMO, there is no way they should have been given licenses.

 

[motoguy82]

I think in most European countries everyone has to pay big money to take actual driver school/training before getting a license. They say in Germany it's over $3000 to get a license. Pretty sure having to pay that much would make you a little more serious about learning the rules and abiding by them.

 

[Marthy]

Few years ago I was in Europe for a Chamcar weekend. We had a race in Brussels and Assen, with few days off in between... so we did a little detour to Nurburgren (Sorry for the spelling...

After our rampage at the track we hit the Autobahn for a good 3 hrs minimum, never when under 100 MPG with plenty of people driving by like if we were stop... guess what. no crash. Here I drive from WPB to Miami and if it rain there someone in the fence or flip over every 20 miles...

 

[Nastybutler]

My big pet peeve is that once you get your license at, say, 16, you never have to be tested again. WTF? So if you get your license in Bumfrack, Iowa at age 16, then move to a major city 20 years later, are you really prepared to handle that? Maybe; but then again, if you've only been driving farm equipment and a beat up pick up truck back and forth to the mill and feed store, perhaps another test or driving class would be in order before you deal with that.

I think at the least you should have to retake another written test every time, or maybe every other time, you renew your license. Once you hit 62 then it should be a written and driving test every time you renew it. Why 62? Because that's when you can collect social security benefits. Sorry those over 62, but don't pretend older folks don't have issues driving, and if you can collect social security, then you are "older."

/rant

 

[2wheelie]

When I did my license at 17, I had to take mandatory 20 to 25 lessons with instructor, going through all sorts of roads and every difficult situations you can run into. When I thought I was ready, it took me 3 attempts to pass the driving test in these conditions. And yes, it cost lots of money to my parents...

Here when my daughter went to the test, it was done in the empty lot behind the DMV building (their test area). It was a real joke... I was shocked thinking how she gona drive on the real road... Good thing I could teach her few things.

There you have it - clueless drivers.

 

[ScottM]

Hey Nasty why pick on people when they turn 62. I think that people who choose to live in Alaska (shiver) should be tested.

 

[Nastybutler]

Fine by me. People up here drive like idiots. If we had real testing it'd keep at least 25% of them off the road. Most people in the US view driving as a right not the privilege that it is.

 

[BoneJj]

My big pet peeve is that once you get your license at, say, 16, you never have to be tested again. WTF? So if you get your license in Bumfrack, Iowa at age 16, then move to a major city 20 years later, are you really prepared to handle that? Maybe; but then again, if you've only been driving farm equipment and a beat up pick up truck back and forth to the mill and feed store, perhaps another test or driving class would be in order before you deal with that.

I think at the least you should have to retake another written test every time, or maybe every other time, you renew your license. Once you hit 62 then it should be a written and driving test every time you renew it. Why 62? Because that's when you can collect social security benefits. Sorry those over 62, but don't pretend older folks don't have issues driving, and if you can collect social security, then you are "older."

/rant

I like this idea.....

I know that here in florida it's every 8 years that you have to renew, I think every 16 years for a retest or something would be outstanding. I personally think that people should be required to do some kind of advanced training periodically. If you want to drive, you need to have better skills to be behind the wheel.

I also agree that older drivers need more scrutiny, I live in florida and I know for a fact that they do.........................

 

[Sage]

In Illinois when I got my license at 16, I had to have minimum 25 hours behind the wheel on the permit then have mandatory drivers ed through the school. Now I think its either 75 or 125 hours behind the wheel with the permit. But what I learned in that time I feel was just a taste of what is out there, I learned so much more at a BMW Performance Driving School in a day that I did during drivers ed and became an even better driver from that. Normal drivers education needs to be more hardcore on accident avoidance, how to control the car properly and such. I feel you should have to do the driving test every time you renew the license to get try and get incompetent drivers off the road.