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Thread: Maps Question For You Guys Running Maps

  1. #1

    Default Maps Question For You Guys Running Maps

    To you guys with with fuel controllers or power commander 3 or 5:

    I picked up a PC Fuel Controller and the tech from PC.com told me I can download and run maps on my Fuel Controller. I specifically asked them if I could download and run custom maps that were created in PC5 and they said yes. But I am now "hearing" that Marthy's Advgear RevB map can't be used? Why is that?

    If it in fact doesn't work, then I'll probably just stick with his Sport Rev A map. All i have done on my bike is Marthy's Exhaust using his Delkevic muffler and I installed block off plates.

    * Edit * So I found out that the Fuel Controller can’t adjust ignition/timing which is why Marthys Advgear RevB map might not work with it. The Power Commanders guys seem to still think a custom map will still be transferable onto the fuel controller. They said the controller just can’t make initial ignition adjustments. This is a little confusing to me because how can it apply them if it can’t make them... we’ll see I guess.
    Last edited by TN6R; 02-24-2018 at 06:49 PM.

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    Senior Member sti491's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TN6R View Post
    To you guys with with fuel controllers or power commander 3 or 5:

    I picked up a PC Fuel Controller and the tech from PC.com told me I can download and run maps on my Fuel Controller. I specifically asked them if I could download and run custom maps that were created in PC5 and they said yes. But I am now "hearing" that Marthy's Advgear RevB map can't be used? Why is that?

    If it in fact doesn't work, then I'll probably just stick with his Sport Rev A map. All i have done on my bike is Marthy's Exhaust using his Delkevic muffler and I installed block off plates.

    * Edit * So I found out that the Fuel Controller can’t adjust ignition/timing which is why Marthys Advgear RevB map might not work with it. The Power Commanders guys seem to still think a custom map will still be transferable onto the fuel controller. They said the controller just can’t make initial ignition adjustments. This is a little confusing to me because how can it apply them if it can’t make them... we’ll see I guess.
    I just looked up your model... coincidently I also just installed a PC5 having talked at some length to Dyno Jet help desk and Martin, who created the Marthy maps.

    None of these devices (for our bikes) will change timing, just fuel. Your PCFC is a simplistic version if the PC5 from what I can tell, a corresponding lower price point. You can load custom maps. But what the PCFC does not have (at least I can't find it in the FC manual on line) that the PC5 does have is the ability to add a wire from the unit to our bikes speed sensor, so the a map designed to be different in different gears can be used. Marthy's ADv Gear Rev B map is a gear specific map, you NEED to have the speed sensor hooked up. Some of his other maps do not require this. Martin made this map because it is rich and torquey in gears 1-3, then the the higher gears are just a bit leaner for better fuel economy... for me every gear pulls like a freight train!... and my MPG's range between 38-41.

    Since your PCFC has the ability to hold multiple maps, you are probably limited to having a map that is all sport (like the first 3 gears I described), but for all gears, and a separate cruising map.

    I would consider selling it and get a PC5, personally. With the PC5 you also can add a remote switch to change between 2 maps as you are riding just pushing a button. ... or, like you said just stick with the Sport Rev A map. It's similar to the first 3 gears on the Adv Gear Rev B, possibly even a bit stronger in upper gears. Your mileage will not be quite as good is all.

    Enjoy! For what it's worth I though easily changing maps would be important to me. Once you find a map you like (I LOVE Adv Gear Rev B), I never change it. I actually disconnected my map switch from the PC and used it for my Lighted Jewel running light.
    Last edited by sti491; 02-26-2018 at 07:43 AM.

  3. #3

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    Thanks for the help with this. I had a lengthily discussion with one of the PC tech's and he confirmed pretty much everything you said. I'll mainly stick with the all sport map and leave it that. I hardly do any highway riding that's over 55 mph and only run my bike during weekends and dry summer days lol. The fuel consumption doesn't bother me.

    Question for you though, when it's time to connect the connectors, should I wrap them with electrical tape to keep out any dust or potential water from washing the bike? The tech suggested it and so I am curious if you do did that yourself?

    Thanks again!

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    Quote Originally Posted by TN6R View Post
    Thanks for the help with this. I had a lengthily discussion with one of the PC tech's and he confirmed pretty much everything you said. I'll mainly stick with the all sport map and leave it that. I hardly do any highway riding that's over 55 mph and only run my bike during weekends and dry summer days lol. The fuel consumption doesn't bother me.

    Question for you though, when it's time to connect the connectors, should I wrap them with electrical tape to keep out any dust or potential water from washing the bike? The tech suggested it and so I am curious if you do did that yourself?

    Thanks again!
    Not sure how yours connects. On my PC5, there are in-line connectors, that is, you undo a factory plug, and plug this in between. These were in large rubber boots on my bike under the tank and did not require any electrical tape. Where I had to tap a wire, I used Vampire type connectors that have a male and female connector. They are pretty water resistant unless they get soaked. I put Tesa Tape on those, but not sure they really needed it. Tesa is like electrical fabric hockey tape. It is forgiving to make wire looms.

    Electrical tape can't hurt, unless you stretch it too tight and it compromises the wire connection..

  5. #5

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    Good info. My controller has the same type of connectors as the PC5 I believe. Here's a quick pic of mine. I'll have to pick up some of that Tesa Tape. Did you use the factory velcro or did you go another route on setting the actual unit in the bike?

    FC.jpg

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    Senior Member sti491's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TN6R View Post
    Good info. My controller has the same type of connectors as the PC5 I believe. Here's a quick pic of mine. I'll have to pick up some of that Tesa Tape. Did you use the factory velcro or did you go another route on setting the actual unit in the bike?

    FC.jpg
    Yes, you only have factory connectors. Your connections are already in a large rubber boot under the tank, behind the airbox. I did not take the tank off, I just propped it up as high as I could. It is tight under there, hard on your fingers too. (I have large hands, not proper small sized Japanese hands)... You know what they say about guys with big hands... big heart :-)

    I recommend you do not use any tape on those connections. Just push the boot back, plug it, and slide the boot back. It will be great that way. Just like the factory did it.

    I mounted my PC under the passenger seat, which is the driest spot on the bike. I used the provided adhesive velcro. It sits on a curved part of the under-fender, so I added a little more velcro on the side. It is rock solid now, but still removable. Remember you will want to see & be able to get to the controllers lights and adjustments. I only needed to be able see the status light. I think yours actually has some adjustment screws. It got pretty crowded in there when I added the alarm.

    Also, since I always have a tailbag on my bike, it's a tad of a PIA to take off my passenger seat. I talked to the Tech at DynoJet about always having the USB attached on the bike. He said it's fine. So mine is always attached. The slack is coiled next to the unit. The other end that plugs into my computer pokes out under the passenger seat between it and the grab rail. I left enough free slack on top of the tool kit so I can pull it out about a foot. I had a spare little plastic USB plug end cover that came with a different USB cord I had, that I use to keep water out, but I doubt that is really needed if you tuck it under there. Then when finished, it tucks nicely back under there firmly so you can't see it. You can see it in the pics below. I like this set up.

    BTW, that is Tesa Tape I used to hold the Alarm controller upside down near the PC5. It has a lot of uses. That alarm is as solid as if I drilled and bolted it. A roll costs $4 on Amazon Prime.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by sti491; 03-01-2018 at 07:43 AM.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by sti491 View Post
    Yes, you only have factory connectors. Your connections are already in a large rubber boot under the tank, behind the airbox. I did not take the tank off, I just propped it up as high as I could. It is tight under there, hard on your fingers too. (I have large hands, not proper small sized Japanese hands)... You know what they say about guys with big hands... big heart :-)

    I recommend you do not use any tape on those connections. Just push the boot back, plug it, and slide the boot back. It will be great that way. Just like the factory did it.

    I mounted my PC under the passenger seat, which is the driest spot on the bike. I used the provided adhesive velcro. It sits on a curved part of the under-fender, so I added a little more velcro on the side. It is rock solid now, but still removable. Remember you will want to see & be able to get to the controllers lights and adjustments. I only needed to be able see the status light. I think yours actually has some adjustment screws. It got pretty crowded in there when I added the alarm.

    Also, since I always have a tailbag on my bike, it's a tad of a PIA to take off my passenger seat. I talked to the Tech at DynoJet about always having the USB attached on the bike. He said it's fine. So mine is always attached. The slack is coiled next to the unit. The other end that plugs into my computer pokes out under the passenger seat between it and the grab rail. I left enough free slack on top of the tool kit so I can pull it out about a foot. I had a spare little plastic USB plug end cover that came with a different USB cord I had, that I use to keep water out, but I doubt that is really needed if you tuck it under there. Then when finished, it tucks nicely back under there firmly so you can't see it. You can see it in the pics below. I like this set up.

    BTW, that is Tesa Tape I used to hold the Alarm controller upside down near the PC5. It has a lot of uses. That alarm is as solid as if I drilled and bolted it. A roll costs $4 on Amazon Prime.
    Nice job man, looks great! I actually installed mine today and have it in the same spot but unfortunately I placed the controller over the metal mount where you place it under and I din't realize it until I already ran the wiring and made the connections. I'll have to reset it all next time I get under the fuel tank... so for now mine is just hanging in that spot resting on a poncho bag I have in that spot as well. My wiring is all neat and clean and zip tied to the main wiring so at least that part is good.

    I'm running power commander's stock exhaust/stock air map and it runs good. I did try Marthy's sport map (not the advanced gear map) but just the sport one and it made my bike smokey at start up and idle. It was like a gray smoke. Is that normal? I was wondering if it’s because I have block off plates installed if not. I wish I knew more about this stuff.

    I also installed new plugs at 9.4 ft/lb torque and with proper gaps. I was a bit surprised to see that the 3rd and 4th plugs were kinda loose before I removed them.
    *** I can't get my pictures any bigger than that...
    Attached Images Attached Images
    • File Type: jpg 3.jpg (14.8 KB, 15 views)
    • File Type: jpg 4.jpg (10.6 KB, 18 views)
    • File Type: jpg 5.jpg (13.8 KB, 14 views)
    Last edited by TN6R; 03-01-2018 at 07:45 PM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by TN6R View Post
    Nice job man, looks great! I actually installed mine today and have it in the same spot but unfortunately I placed the controller over the metal mount where you place it under and I din't realize it until I already ran the wiring and made the connections. I'll have to reset it all next time I get under the fuel tank... so for now mine is just hanging in that spot resting on a poncho bag I have in that spot as well. My wiring is all neat and clean and zip tied to the main wiring so at least that part is good.

    I'm running power commander's stock exhaust/stock air map and it runs good. I did try Marthy's sport map (not the advanced gear map) but just the sport one and it made my bike smokey at start up and idle. It was like a gray smoke. Is that normal? I was wondering if it’s because I have block off plates installed if not. I wish I knew more about this stuff.

    I also installed new plugs at 9.4 ft/lb torque and with proper gaps. I was a bit surprised to see that the 3rd and 4th plugs were kinda loose before I removed them.
    *** I can't get my pictures any bigger than that...
    Good job!

    Let's tackle your your questions and questions I have from reading your post.

    1. Tourquing spark plugs. I am a huge supporter of using Torque wrenches where you can, nearly always. Using one as you did at factory specs is fine. What I am about to tell you is an opinion after working on cars for 40 years... and that's all it is, you know what the say, opinions are like butts, everyone has one. Here is mine:

    When you use a torque wrench it's important to know it's calibrated. I have three T wrenches. 1/2 and 1/4' drives, and an ity bity one I recently got the does inch lbs really well. Works great for valve covers and our bike's engine covers. I check one wrench against the other to be sure mine are in spec. You can also have a tool truck guy or store check them. I try to think about the application. Some engine bolts, like head bolts have a stretch to them so it is critical. Some you just don't want to strip the threads, or compress a soft or hollow gasket: that's a spark plug. The result of torquing a spark plug too tight is pretty bad. You have to put a helicoil or other threaded insert in your engine head. If anything goes wrong with that long torque wrench, which is a big lever without much feel, it could happen. Probably won't.... but could.

    Here is what I do. Check the gap as you did. Apply a small amount of nickel based anti sieze to the threads (silver color, not copper). Hand tighten until the the gasket meets the head. Use a shorty ratchet wrench by hand. If you don't have a shorty, choke up on a normal one so you have little leverage. The less leverage you have the better. After hand tightening, turn the wrench between a 1/4 turn to 1/2 turn tighter. When I did this method on my bike, using a shorty wretch that is shorter than my palm is long, it was hard to get it turned 1/2 turn. Perfect. It might be possible, but highly improbable you will ever strip out a spark plug thread this way. My 2 cents... somebody might flame me for this opinion. It's old school.

    2. I would like to see a close up of the plug tips that you removed. If they are all the same then only need one pic. If they look like the one in my pic, then I don't even need a pic. If not, or if they are significantly darker, that would be good to know answering your question about smoke.

    3. Grey smoke can mean a few things. Was it grey, white grey or blue grey? In that it changed with a map change, I'll assume it is really grey. That can mean it is running rich. Which could be the map... but I have not heard of Martin's maps causing this. These maps don't change idle mixture much I don't think. If it's rich enough to blow grey smoke, your plugs would be a darker color. Was it cool out when you started it? White, or white grey is usually water in the combustion chamber. Since an engine is a big pump that compresses air, squeezing liquid water from air, it can be completely normal. That is why water drips out an exhaust pipe. Was it whitish grey and cool out? It should go away after it warms up on your bike though. Maybe you tried this first when your bike was cold, then you went to the other map when it was warmer? Blue grey is usually oil burning and your map switch would not affect this.

    I would check everything you did switching to this map, to be sure you were running the right map you thought you were. If it pushes grey smoke continually with that map don't use it. Your block off plates should have nothing to do with this. You might want to message Martin about it (aka, Marthy). He has been very helpful to me. None of his maps smoked on my bike.

    4. How many miles are on your bike?

    5. The DynoJet map worked great on my bike. Martin's map worked better. Some say every bike is different though....

    The spark plug pic below is from my bike at 3,000 miles. I changed them because I was in there doing the block off plates, they did not need changing. They are the original plugs. An old school carburetor guy would consider that plug clean as a whistle and a bit lean. On a modern fuel injected bike like ours, it's normal; and perfect. It will be interesting when I pull them again after all my mods, and running a fairly rich map. I bet they don't look much different. Fuel injection is a wonderful thing!
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by sti491; 03-02-2018 at 04:54 AM.

  9. #9

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    Great info on the torque wrench and hey man, I value opinions. Especially from guys who are more knowledgeable than me and I can see that you definitely are.

    I generally perform the hand tighten and 1/4" seat method myself and am mainly a car guy, but am still learning on bikes. I had my torque wrench tested for accuracy shortly after I bought it because I just wanted peace of mind that it was accurate. I treat it like a piece of glass, lol. I sent you a PM about the spark plugs. I'm interested to know what you think on that.

    I included a pic below of a close up on my plugs (they all look like that) but let me give you a quick back story about my bike. I bought it in 2016 and it was bone stock with 7K miles. The guy who I bought it from was the original owner and the bike is pristine. At around 7500 miles I put on marthy's slip on Delkevic exhaust and install block off plates. I also replaced the stock air filter with another stock Yamaha air filter so no air box mod done yet. That's about all she had done since I did the plugs yesterday and PCFC.

    To my knowledge the plugs I pulled yesterday are original. They all the look the same too. My bike has never smoked before yesterday so after installing the map, it smoked a lot. Definitely gray smoke but I didn't ride it like that but rather it just idled like that. I revved it a couple times to see if it would clear out but it didn't and then it actually died when the RPMs went down to idle. At that point, I installed another map (the stock exhaust/stock air filter from pc.com) and it stopped smoking almost immediately. At that point I took it for a ride and it seemed to run very well. I'm not sure if the map I got from Marthy was the correct one for me because I only have the PC Fuel Controller and not the PCV. He sent me another map that I'll try later today and see if that one is good. It very well could be that his maps aren't compatible with my controller but the PC tech said any map made on a PCV should work on my PCFC.

    Martin has been helpful certainly and I appreciate his input to this site as well. Worse case scenario for me is after I do the timing advanced mod, I'll take my bike in for a dyno tune if I can't find a suitable map. I know the one I am using now is good but it could be better I think. I wish I got a PCV and could just run the adv gear map, but I didn't and my wife and I have an understanding that my money needs to go to other things than just myself lol.

    Thanks for your suggestions and I've been learning from you and hope to learn more. Quick edit: took a short video this morning with Marthy's FZ6R Sport Map - looks good: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIX3...ature=youtu.be

    7 by mrxracer12, on Flickr
    6 by mrxracer12, on Flickr
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    Last edited by TN6R; 03-02-2018 at 10:11 AM.

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    Zac, your bike sounds an idles exactly like my bike!

    If you still have the old plugs, please take a pic of one at an angle like I sent you, so I can see more inside the tip where the ceramic is. Thanks. I think you are good man. I would like to see that plug though.

    So, on these old plugs, you were running the Delkevic can with no fuel management? For how long? I'm curious, it probably doesn't matter. The color of that ceramic inside the end of the plug does matter to see though. It tells A LOT about the health of your engine and set up.

    Thanks, Rob

    Quote Originally Posted by TN6R View Post
    Great info on the torque wrench and hey man, I value opinions. Especially from guys who are more knowledgeable than me and I can see that you definitely are.

    I generally perform the hand tighten and 1/4" seat method myself and am mainly a car guy, but am still learning on bikes. I had my torque wrench tested for accuracy shortly after I bought it because I just wanted peace of mind that it was accurate. I treat it like a piece of glass, lol. I sent you a PM about the spark plugs. I'm interested to know what you think on that.

    I included a pic below of a close up on my plugs (they all look like that) but let me give you a quick back story about my bike. I bought it in 2016 and it was bone stock with 7K miles. The guy who I bought it from was the original owner and the bike is pristine. At around 7500 miles I put on marthy's slip on Delkevic exhaust and install block off plates. I also replaced the stock air filter with another stock Yamaha air filter so no air box mod done yet. That's about all she had done since I did the plugs yesterday and PCFC.

    To my knowledge the plugs I pulled yesterday are original. They all the look the same too. My bike has never smoked before yesterday so after installing the map, it smoked a lot. Definitely gray smoke but I didn't ride it like that but rather it just idled like that. I revved it a couple times to see if it would clear out but it didn't and then it actually died when the RPMs went down to idle. At that point, I installed another map (the stock exhaust/stock air filter from pc.com) and it stopped smoking almost immediately. At that point I took it for a ride and it seemed to run very well. I'm not sure if the map I got from Marthy was the correct one for me because I only have the PC Fuel Controller and not the PCV. He sent me another map that I'll try later today and see if that one is good. It very well could be that his maps aren't compatible with my controller but the PC tech said any map made on a PCV should work on my PCFC.

    Martin has been helpful certainly and I appreciate his input to this site as well. Worse case scenario for me is after I do the timing advanced mod, I'll take my bike in for a dyno tune if I can't find a suitable map. I know the one I am using now is good but it could be better I think. I wish I got a PCV and could just run the adv gear map, but I didn't and my wife and I have an understanding that my money needs to go to other things than just myself lol.

    Thanks for your suggestions and I've been learning from you and hope to learn more. Quick edit: took a short video this morning with Marthy's FZ6R Sport Map - looks good: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIX3...ature=youtu.be

    7 by mrxracer12, on Flickr
    6 by mrxracer12, on Flickr

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